*Transcript by Descript*

 Today on our podcast, we probably have one of the most well known people in the retail, research, investment communities joining our podcast, Debra Weinswig. She’s CEO and founder of CoreSite Research, which by the way, if you don’t know, it’s a research data event advisory firm that focuses on the intersection of retail and technology

Deborah also serves on many boards. And is involved in many philanthropic organizations. And here’s her fun fact. Debra, you’re also a certified public accountant. I am. I gotta tell you, that is the, I, I talked to somebody yesterday and I’ve never quite had that reception to saying I was a CPA. They’re like, you, you were a CPA?

They’re like, that’s, and this is something I really respect. They’re like, that’s amazing. And I’m like, You know, I said it was honestly the  of any background you could have, right. To be doing what I’m doing now, because not only was it, and I worked in public accounting, so, you know, one of the big six at the time, big four now at PwC.

And so not only did you, well, first of all, you were working with incredibly senior people. Right? I mean, you’re literally, and, and, you know, and as a young person, you’re like, you know, I just don’t understand why the CFO of this public company isn’t getting me this tomorrow.  And, you know, because you just didn’t understand and you like, you had a deadline you had to stay on.

And if somebody didn’t tell you, and so you really learned to work with like a large group of people, you learn to really like balance your time and you know, you became an expert not only in kind of, you know, Basically accounting regulations, but also I was, what was it? You’ll love this. They call it the garbage team because like literally I was, and I kid, you know, I’m not making up what I’m about to say.

I literally would be auditing Playboy one day and Alumax was at the time, like the third largest aluminum manufacturer in the world and Wilson’s sporting goods and like, you know, literally everything in between. And so you learn so much. About so many different industries and you had to go really narrow and deep and so  with what I do now with research It’s been like the best background.

Oh, that’s amazing. I really dislike accounting. I’m just gonna be completely transparent here I did horrible in school. I can do retail math like crazy financial analysis like crazy accounting Just couldn’t get through it. So I admire that quality about you. I have to tell you one more thing. So I When I was at PwC, I had this very, they’re like two of us in this program where we spent six months in audit and six months in tax.

And I was like, you know, I want to learn as much as I can. So it was fascinating. When I was doing tax, I would actually dream, you cannot make this up. I would dream like if there was something that wasn’t footing, which of course happened all the time, you would like literally in the middle of the night, I’m like, Oh, I figured it out.

And then I’d wake up and I’d like have a notepad next to my bed and I was like, Okay, this is like, I’ve got to like, I am like way too into this, I’ve got to like, you know, kind of get to the other side, but it is interesting how one’s brain does work if, if one has an accounting brain. That’s so interesting.

Well, hey, listen, Debra, I used to think I was like super productive, you know, until I met you, and I think I met you like a decade ago. You are so prolific in your contributions to the industry. They’re so broad, they’re so deep. Not to mention all the philanthropic work that you do.  It’s just amazing. So we could actually spend our entire podcast just talking about all of your many contributions and accolades and awards and research.

You’re literally on the top of every influencer, analyst, investor, pundit list in our industry. But let’s start our interview by asking you to share your journey from kind of research or even being a CPA or being an investment Analyst to really starting your own company CoreSite Research.  Well, it’s very funny that you know the topic for today So  our associate director of research had asked me we had an intern class and she’s like, you know Can you come in and just you know do this kind of introduction of yourself and CoreSite and I was like gosh I’m like I really hadn’t prepared for it, but I don’t want to let people down and so literally She kicked it off and I like literally I don’t think I took a breath and it was like 30 minutes later She’s like, well, thanks.

That’s it for today. I’m like, but I didn’t even get started, right?  Like so it’s true. It’s when you’re passionate about something I mean, I think that goes and Shelley you’ve always been so passionate about what you’ve done as well  And I think to me, when you’re passionate, it doesn’t feel like work, right

It’s, there’s a joy about it. Now, of course we, you know, I would say there, there ends up being some of the administrative stuff and whatnot, but I also think if you kind of just, if you don’t let that kind of pile up, if you just kind of plow through it right away, then it doesn’t build up and kind of feel like this kryptonite that’s, you know, weighing on you.

So.  If I were to kind of go way back, um, I’m going to go back to when I was in sixth grade,  I was certain I wanted to be a doctor.  I loved everything about science. I always asked the question why. I wanted to, going back to, I wanted to do something, I wanted to do something that had an impact on the world.

And I wanted to do something good. That’s what I always said. And so 6th grade, I was like, I knew it when I took a lot of, you know, when I went to high school.  Herein lies the reason that I discovered later than I should have that Dr. Hood was not in my cards. So freshman year, I take honor science. Then I take chem, then I take advanced chem and AP chem, and then I’m taking physics.

But what you realize is there’s no biology in there.  So I literally went through all of high school with no biology. And I had been a very Devout vegan,  so I had, you know, kind of just, you know,  not only kind of in terms of I never spent my time like seeing dead animals and I didn’t spend my time eating anything that was animal dry at the time.

So I go to, I had this amazing opportunity,  got into Indiana University into a, basically an honors chemistry 40 of us and right, everybody was on like the fast track to med school.  And so I love the chemistry. I mean, it was just beyond anything. I had a great lab partner. I mean,  That was great. That was first semester, second semester, you’re taking like honors biology.

So everything’s accelerated. And I mean, I remember I actually like, I did not, I mean, I was just like woozy, right? Like it was even with like the bugs. I mean, I was just like, I was like, I can’t, I mean, you know, there’s like a dead bug here that I know didn’t, didn’t need, right. So it’s not like a dead bug that was outside of the lab that like, you know, had already no expired.

Right. This. This bug was deemed dead to, so I could look at it and I just, like my, at the time, like my, my moral conviction was so at odds with what you were doing, it  was like physical for me though.  And so I spent a semester and I just, I, I ended up,  I realized doctorhood was not for me. So I took sociology, psychology, philosophy, and art history.

And I kid you not, cause you cannot make this up. I’m like, I want to be an accountant because what I loved is, well, I didn’t really know about finance. Right. I knew about accounting cause I was like, I realized I love numbers. Right.  I, and for me, like I love the labs, right. Because I could almost see, right.

I knew where we,  I could understand what the outcome was supposed to be.  And then I knew kind of along the way, if our numbers were, were not working. And so you were like, you know, I’d be like mid lab and I’m like, something’s wrong with our experiment. So like we would, this is like my lab partner. I’m like, we would go back to the beginning and figure out, right.

What were we doing wrong? So we never had to repeat labs. We were able to kind of like adjust it in real time. Wow. And so to me, I’m like, oh, accounting, that’s, that’s as close to numbers as I could get. Well, going from honors chemistry, at least from my brain to accounting, I was like. I have so much time, right?

What am I going to do with all my extra time? So I took on like a part time job and like, oh, I mean, you know, stuff that you can’t make up. And, but I loved it. I had an internship.  Cannot tell you how much I was like, this is for me. I love working. I mean, for those of you who know me, I am not shy. You’re working in a room with 20 people and all you do, for any of you who’ve been in accounting or other words,  like all you do is write, you’re working, but you’re talking with everybody in the room, right?

Your, your brain literally is. Doing the work in front of you. And sometimes you’re having a social conversation about the client, about work or about things that have nothing to do with, with, you know, kind of what’s in front of you.  And, you know, graduated, went on to work at PwC and had this kind of very kind of diverse background in terms of what I covered  and in about the first year, I was like, okay, right.

Like I’ve mastered this now. What?  And that was, I think at the point I realized that there needed to be kind of another career for me because. I got promoted incredibly early, right? I spent half my year in audit and tax, and I still got promoted in half the amount of time that somebody normally does, even with all of those, so I’d only spent a year actually in audit and I got promoted to be a senior, which was way too early.

And so then I’m spending all my time in like the regulations, which I did not view as fun as the, I like the client work and I like sitting in the room with everybody. And right. Like, and so, cause the regulation stuff was almost like being a lawyer. And so I was like, I don’t think this is for me. So I was like, business school, that’s going to get me from here to there.

And so that, so I  applied for business school. I got into university Chicago. I got a scholarship because yeah. So even as a, I grew up in a home, my parents were very philanthropic.  And when I was at PWC, I volunteered for junior achievement.  And I was living in Chicago at the time,  and you can’t make this up, the very first day I was with this teacher, she said to me,  I know I have a good class this year because nobody has told me to F off.

And I’m like, okay, I am in a whole new, but I will tell you, I realized like I loved, without knowing it,  I love the stock market. And so what I did is I had each student,  you know, whether it was where their parents worked, Or a brand they loved pick a stock. I taught them, I don’t even know how I knew how to do this myself, but we, we basically, you know, kind of use the wall street journal to track stock prices.

And I had them, you know, we came in once a week, I had them kind of follow this company and tell us something new each week. And what I did on the first day, I had them fill out, right. What they wanted to do, other things that were, you know, kind of interesting about them, right? Like, you know. What were their hobbies?

Did they like any sports? And it was amazing in 16 weeks what that card was on day one and what that card was on the last day because literally some of them were like, I want to be a fireman. I want to be a professional baseball player.  And by the end it was a completely different. And I was like, you know what?

I loved it. First of all, it was only 16 weeks and you could see the impact you had, but I was like, I love this ability to kind of talk through, talk to people through stocks.  Through telling stories, like that’s a great project.  And so I, so when I went to business school, I was like, I wanna do something with, you know, kind of the markets and stocks and telling stories and found I, I was literally an n of one.

I was the only person in my graduating class at University of Chicago who went on to equity research because at the time nobody even really, I mean, right. These departments were fairly small in the banks, but people were going into banking  and they didn’t even recruit. Right. It was either like I banking or sales and trading.

And I spent my summer internship at Bear  Stearns and yeah. And so  at University of Chicago, we were on the quarter system.  So we ended late, but then we went back late. And so I, they let me, I asked, I said, you know, when, when the new training class comes in, can I join them and whatnot, and  I will tell you, it was an experience like no others.

I was on the wrist garb desk. I spent time in capital markets. I spent time as in convert. Oh,  Shelly, this, this is the best.  So my mentor was on the converts desk  and he asked me, he’s like, can you look in the, you know, this convert baby super stores? I’m like, sure.  So I start researching and I’m not going to give away any dates because  that’s not what we do at this, at this point in our lives.

No, but not many people were using the internet then.  And we were all on dial ups too. So.  I spent, I mean, for those, you know me, I don’t sleep that much, never have. And so I pull an all nighter, like I just don’t leave the office. I don’t think anyone knows I was wearing the same clothes the next day. Cause it was like a blue suit skirt suit.

And so I hand him a 27 page report on baby superstores and he’s like, where did you get this? And I’m like, I wrote it.  He’s like, but how did you write it? I said, I researched it.  He’s like, what does that even mean? He’s like, how would you research it? I’m like, I went onto the internet. Now me,  YG Shelly,  or some other,  at that point, nobody was blocking websites.

So let’s just say as a fairly  naive person.  There was also like sex superstores, and I had like an education like no other Research project,  but I’ll leave that the past in the past and he was just like it’s a little like I sat down with him Like not when the markets were open, but I think you know after four o’clock and I showed him how I didn’t he’s like This is just incredible and he’s like, you know He’s like if you thought about research and I was like, I’ve been thinking I mean I’m I said I’m thinking about a lot of things.

I said, I really enjoyed it. I love the wrist garb desk And so I ended up spending the last six weeks of my internship in research.  I wrote a, I was with Dana Telsy. I wrote a 97 page report.  She let me put my name on the cover. I mean, who else had that coming out of their summer internship?  That’s unbelievable.

It was, but I knew at the end, what was so incredible about how bare and put this, well, it was kind of  self driven internship, if you will.  But there was a formal program around it that. I knew for sure this is what I wanted to do. And to have that level of conviction going into my second year of business school was unbelievable.

And then, Hey, to have as your kind of calling card, a 97 page report you wrote with your name on it, that was kind of, that set me up, you know, I’d say better than if I had an internship in, let’s say another field. And so I will tell you, I only interviewed for  Equity Research.  I had a wealth of opportunities.

I was very grateful to, you know, and I will tell you so many people I met during the recruiting process, I’ve like run into later in my life. And you’re like, do you remember this? And do you remember that? And I mean, it’s, it’s unbelievable. And so I ended up,  I’m sure they’re saying to themselves, how did we lose her?

How did we lose her? How did she not come here?  Well, and it’s funny because. So I ended up, and I remember,  I will say this about Dana because she was amazing.  I was like, cause I had an offer from Bayer and I said, I’m just going to accept it. And she’s like, Debra, that’s not the best thing for you. She’s like, I would love for you to be here.

She’s like, but you need to go out and I mean, who, what mentor ever says this? Well, maybe a mentor does, but a boss doesn’t. Right. So she said, you should go out and see what else is out there. And right. If you come back to us, then this is right. But she’s like, you really need to go look and see what the other banks are like and whatnot.

So. I ended up going to Morgan Stanley. I did not return to Bear Stearns immediately. And what was so interesting there is I was always very interested in like the, I’d say the global landscape  and the role I ended up taking was even though I was hired as an analyst, I ended up on the strategy team,  which was unbelievable.

And I worked on this product. It was actually the first. Of its kind, it was called the competitive edge.  It was like, you know,  kind of research driven stock portfolio, but we actually turned it into a product at Morgan Stanley investment management.  So it was, and it was global. So I got to go meet everybody, right?

You’re going down to LATAM and you’re flying to Japan and you’re flying to China. I mean, and going back to like my, kind of my role at PwC, I got to be an expert in a lot of different industries. I mean, I covered, that’s amazing. Asia, pulp and paper, AMD, right? I mean, you know, these, you got to learn BMW, right?

Like, so you had to become an expert in autos and chips and all these things because you only own 40 stocks in this portfolio. I mean, you had to know not only the company and the management, but you needed to know the sector because, and you know, like I was, you know, I lived in fear. We all, and by the way, Shelley, I don’t know if you knew people who worked at Morgan Stanley at the time, we would all sleep under our desks.

Like, we literally Well, that was required, right? I mean, that was kind of like the unwritten rule. Well, it was like, but you were trying to squeeze more hours out of the day, so you’re like, okay, it’s 30 minutes to get home, it’s 30 minutes to get back, we have a gym, I can just run up there for a quick shower, and I can like, you know, you’d order your dinner at night and put it in the little fridge in your office and you’d eat it for breakfast the next day, right?

I mean, that was like the, the time.  And it was, I loved everything about it. Um,  if you, you know, if you go back in time, right, at Morgan Stanley, at the time we had Barton Biggs, who I was very, very close to, he’s not with us anymore, Byron Wien, Peter Canelo, and Leah Modigliani. And we would get, on Monday mornings, we would, we would have this.

These are the things when you go back in your life and you think about it, right? What had an impact on you or what you really loved, because It’s like emotional of course,  and we would we would have breakfast right we’d have like, you know Our croissants and our bagels and our fruit  and coffee and we would all talk.

I love these memories I have of this meeting every Monday  We would talk about what we were gonna say Right when we got up on on the dais, right? We had five minutes or whatever seven maybe sometimes  they ran Scott Slayton ran a very tough and tight like morning call very good And  so we would be up there and every, I mean, I’d see it three out of four weeks or three out of five weeks depending on the month.

So Barton and Byron, Barton would be like, this is what I’m going to talk about. So Byron would always go first because Byron was just U. S. and like Barton was global.  And I’d say nine times out of 10, Barton would talk about something completely different and make Byron look like an oaf. I was like, I’m like either this is, and like they had this whole fire and ice thing, I’m like.

Either Byron knows, but I was like, how could he possibly know? Cause they just agreed to talk about this other thing. And you know, and our salespeople loved it, right? Because they can see this  drama. And so I really enjoyed the very kind of macro side of things, but also going back to kind of my  experience  through junior achievement, I really knew I had a passion for stocks as well.

And so.  I was offered three sectors at Morgan Stanley,  and I don’t know what you think about this, Shelly, but  their belief was that in, you know, people would write back, then people would stay in their, you know, at, at the companies for a long time, that in 10 years, you should have three different roles.

And so they were, so after kind of, you know, two and a half years, when I expressed an interest, you know, kind of  go back to like what I thought my calling was as an analyst.  They really did try to accommodate that. So they offered me, we’re talking as, as unsexy as it gets in terms of sectors.  And I got offered cement,  not make this up packaging  and specialty chemicals.

Oh gosh. And I’m like,  nah, it was like, and I don’t know, I don’t know if you’re this way, but like. Sometimes you’re like, I’m going to go to sleep and I’m going to see,  well, I mean, and Hey, maybe like the, you know, kind of the tax form fills itself out in your head or you have this epiphany. Yeah. And I’m like, let me wake up in the morning and see how I feel.

I’m like, no,  it’s, I mean,  it’s just not there.  And it was a really hard decision because I love Morgan Stanley. I loved everything about it. They were very philanthropic. I got very involved in student sponsor partnership through them  and  a We’ll say, and I worked directly with the head of global research with Mary Clark.

And then at the time our head of US research was Dennis Shea.  And so I reached back out to Dana and I was like,  yep. And so I was like,  I know I’ve loved working there on stocks with you. And so  what I didn’t realize was exactly how  my journey was going to go there because now, right, I’d spent two and a half years as a strategist.

So right. And this is back before there was kind of, you know, this is when banking and research worked more closely together.  And the bankers were like.  What does she know? So you’re, so going back to like how, for me personally, philanthropy and my professional life are so interwoven.  So  I’m like, I’m just not going to get this job.

I can feel it. And so I sit down with this guy, Andy Bugis, he’s. It’s like the head of banking at the time. And so, and I’m just not connecting, right? Like you can just feel there’s something like we’re not.  And I look over, I can’t make this up. And there was like a student sponsor partnership mug. Oh my gosh.

I’m like, you’re involved in SSP. And he’s like, yeah, I kid you not. We talked for like an hour and a half nonstop about student sponsor partnership and as, as amazing of the work that. Morgan Stanley did. So for those of you don’t know,  Bear Stearns, when, when the street lost bear, they didn’t just lose right a bank.

They also lost a huge contribution to philanthropy because the senior managing directors, I believe managing directors as well, you were required to give 4 percent of your pre tax income to charitable causes and you had to like literally hand in your, they weren’t just like, Oh, this is a nice thing to do.

You actually had to hand in your tax returns so that they could  validate that you had upheld that.  And so what you would do is amazing. You would send it. Yeah. So I obviously ended up going to work there. So you would send a little, like a flyer  with a kind of letter attached on why this organization was important to you and people would give, right.

And, and it was unbelievable. And so Andy had all of these stories about how different very senior people. I mean, little people had adopted children. I mean, I’m telling you. What people there had done for this, you know, organization, which is basically taking children who are at risk. Yeah, because  the Catholic schools were affordable.

We would take children and we would, you know, kind of match them with a Catholic school also in their neighborhoods. They didn’t have to travel. That’s right. We would provide we had, you know, we would provide mentorship and so  That was like my checkbox at Bear Stearns and, you know, I, I joined a few weeks later.

Well, let me ask you a question. So, correct me if I’m wrong, because I don’t come from banking and I don’t come from equity research, but, um, at that time, were there a lot, besides Dana, were there a lot of, like, women in that field? How was it being a female? And what I would consider to be, I think a very male dominated to both industries are kind of male dominated at that time.

You know, Shelley, it was interesting when you asked me to do this podcast, I really took a giant step back and thought about in my life how  I had, I was, I’ve been very fortunate.  I’ve had very strong women as mentors, literally every step of the way. So during my summer internship, or excuse me, during my.

Internship at PwC, which was, um, during busy season. So second semester, my junior year, there was a woman at the name. At the time, her name was Ada Rodriguez. She got married, became Ada Moduno,  and she had been a very important mentor to me.  And then there was a woman  when I went back full time and  her name was Deanna Harnett, she was also a triathlete, which I eventually became.

And so she was really kind of my mentor. And if you go right into my summer, I had Dana. And then when I was at Morgan Stanley, my boss, Mary Clark was a very strong woman. And I remember I just, maybe I love you, but she’s about my size. Shelly and I are about the same size, right? Yeah. Yeah. It we’re, we’re kind of  on the very side.

And so you would walk in a room and like fear. I mean, there’s just, there’s like palpable fear because she was so smart. I mean, I’ve never met anybody. I mean, who could cut through so much so quickly.  And just truly like an icon. And then I went to work with Dana at Bayer. And if you think about it, right, I’ve always had women as mentors.

And maybe in some ways, I don’t know. I’ve, like I said, she’ll need to prepare for this day. I really thought about it. Were they more comfortable with being very direct with me? I don’t know.  But if I were to kind of take this over to, to go in a city group,  it may be helpful in terms of the, the context of this, because I stayed at Bayer for two years, I was recruited by city, which, you know.

I mean, first of all, we had all of the, at the time of the brokers, right? We had Smith Barney. So you just had this platform and you can move stocks. I mean, you know, it was, it was amazing.  And I was definitely way over my head. I mean,  I mean, just the size, the sheer size of the bank, right. Because we’re going to stay at the time.

You know, Morgan Stanley has Smith Barney, but at the time, right. It was just a,  we, we didn’t have that breadth Baird in either. And so you’re going into this like juggernaut and. It was, I felt a little lost and well, I was definitely lost.  And so I remember I initiated coverage and I had these two women,  Ellen and Jodi, who came to me and said,  we need to have a conversation

I’m like, okay. Right. Like,  and they were super direct. They’re like, you know, you can’t be like all over the place. You have to have three key points.  We’re hearing from 20 analysts a day that all have great content. You have to stand out.  And they said, you know, we’re going to meet like once a week.  And I was like, we are.

I’m like, okay,  let’s do this. Like homework. I love homework. Right. Like going back to my audit program. Like, okay. And, and so  I will tell you, they really took me under their wing and  they really worked very hard because it was really different from anything I’d experienced, but I’ve had strong women. And those who also really gave of their time and energy freely, that I think made a major impact on my career.

Because if they hadn’t come up to me, I don’t know how I would have done. Hopefully somebody else would have, or, you know, before I completely, you know, flunked out. But I was, you know, like I said, when they hire you at a senior level, they just assume you can do it.  But I, you know, this is such a different platform than anyone.

It’s interesting, Shelley, when you start to think about those who’ve made an impact  The threat is, I mean, for me, it really was this strong group of women. That’s amazing.  Let me switch gears for a second because earlier I talked about your high level of productivity and everything you do and your balancing running your own company, being on all these boards, doing this community service, and of course you have your personal life too

Like, how do you balance everything? How do you prioritize? And do you have any, like, strategies you can share with us about how do you maintain well being? And avoid burnout. So number one, I would say in terms of the, I mean, first of all, and I say this to employees, like health, it always comes first because if you don’t have your health, you don’t have anything.

So you have to take care. And for every, right, we’re all very unique. So for. Everyone that is something very different. I think that’s, you know, as a leader, that’s something, you know, some people, I mean, I’ve got people on our team who in like what they can do in five hours. I can’t do in 15, right? They’re just kind of that level of productive, right?

I, as people who know me, I like to boil the ocean. I really like to think about everything. And it’s just sure. I probably could get done in five, but it’s not, I wouldn’t enjoy my job as much.  And So, I think health first,  family second, I mean, you know, because if you don’t have your health, then you can’t be there for your family.

And then I think work is third, and I think if you always, when you have tough decisions to make,  if you always put them in that order, I mean, I’m, I’m going to be open with you. There was a doctor’s appointment. I was asked to cancel almost, I mean, I still remember it,  almost a year ago for a client meeting.

I still think about that sometimes because I’m like, you know, we should never make anyone in our organization do that because then took me like six months to reschedule it.  We have to,  we have to kind of practice what we preach. I was asked to do it. You know, other people in the organization were like, this is a really important client.

Okay. But those are the things we can’t, cause like I still think about it. I’m like, here I am telling people this is how they should do things. And I sacrifice this myself. So I think it goes back to.  The, if you use that order always when you’re trying to make decisions, it does make it really easy. And sometimes, I mean, there’s been conferences I’ve been at and I’m there, but I have to leave a day early to attend to something for my children’s school or, you know, kind of in my larger family, extended family.

And so that I think is, when you have that kind of  You know, priority set, it’s helpful. And then going back to what I said earlier on, there’s all, and I think I felt like, I don’t know about you. I felt like a piled up all this admin stuff during the pandemic, because just the ways that we had done things in the past,  we were like looking around and it was all just us.

And since you weren’t talking to people, you couldn’t kind of like get things off your plate as easily. And it was, it became very formal. Like I had somebody who reached out to me a few days ago and they’re like, Oh, should we?  I said, no, I said, I will pick up the phone and call you the minute. Like, you know what I mean?

It’s like, actually it’s after this. I’m like, no, no more. Like, you know, I’m like, I, and I think that going back to just thinking about how we’re spending our time. And then I do,  I work out  almost every day. And so I, you know,  and I’ll go through periods where it’s, it’s.  It’s different, so I’ll, I’ll tell you,  and I did post something on LinkedIn about this about  two months ago now,  I ended up staying in the city.

My son is actually going to senior in high school and so he’s got a lot of stress on him studying for the SATs and college and all this. And so I’m like, you know, it probably just makes sense for us to stay in,  stay in the city in the weekend and really kind of like drill down. So like  husband, rest of the family all went out  to the beach or whatever.

And so we stayed there. So  I fell asleep, right there, you know, 10  PM on Saturday night.  I do, and I also too, I don’t, I try not to do any work at all on Saturday. So that’s also like my  absolutely, I may think about it, but I really try not to actually do anything like even, you know,  and so. I’d had a fairly, at least, you know, kind of relaxing day.

So I fell asleep at like 10 o’clock on Saturday night. I wake up, I don’t, I don’t require a lot of sleep. I will go up at like 6am on Sunday morning. I’m like, what do people do at 6am on Sunday morning?  Well, when I was, I’m like, I used to go to, you know, I used to run races and stuff like that, I was a competitive athlete.

I’m like, let me look on like my gym app and see what’s going on. Like maybe there’s some kind of race or something. I don’t know what I was thinking.  And I’m like, oh, there’s classes. I’d actually never been to a class before. I know I am like some things you discover later in life, you know, I am, I’m okay being a late bloomer.

And so I looked, I’m like, remember of Equinox? I’m like, oh my gosh, look at all these classes and they’re all like a 10 minute walk. And so I went to a Tabata Max class. Oh my gosh. Not only did I talk to the instructor afterwards and I said to her, I said, I just want you, this is my first class. She’s like, oh, the first class you’ve taken with, I’m like.

No, I said my first class. She’s like your first class at this location. I’m like, no, my first class ever. She’s like, this is amazing. And so she’s like, and what she did is she’s like,  tomorrow I’m teaching at this time at this location. The next day I’m teaching here at this location. And she set out this like path for me.

And so if I have been in the city or even I was in Toronto  and I’m on the board of Primaris or companies based there. I have been to an Equinox to take a class because I mean, I mean, when you think about it, like I’m the kind, I do sleep in my workout clothes often because it’s one less thing to do in the morning, but if, if you’re already waking up and you’re in your workout clothes, right.

And you have a time that you’re supposed to be somewhere, right. You show up. There’s not that much motivation that you need to get from here to there.  And I think Shelly, because at least for me, a lot of the admin stuff I find is like, that’s where I need to motivate because I’m like, it’s just, it’s just.

Sometimes a lot that you have to get through, but you need to do that to get to the other side. So  I actually reserve a lot of my energy  for some of the, the more kind of task oriented stuff. Interesting. And if I can keep that like motivational juice in  the fridge, ready to go. That’s kind of how I think about it.

So I really do take, and I’ve always, I, for those of you who don’t know, I have celiac, unfortunately, or fortunately.  So I’ve always had to be really, really careful with what I eat. I was diagnosed in 20,  and They thought I had a brain tumor, so I had a lot of CAT scans done.  And I ended up having, I won’t, I won’t use his name because I’m not sure if he would want me to, but I had an executive who I was doing a non deal roadshow with of a retailer.

And you know, we, at that time, you didn’t really talk much about yourself. And he’s like, we just spent three days together though in Europe marketing. And like, I felt a little bit more, you know, open and comfortable. And so he’s like, how are you? And I’m like, I’m not good. I’m like, I’m really not. I’m like, it feels like somebody is like literally taking a baseball bat through the back of my head.

And it felt like, like literally like. through my eyes. They’re like putting like a baseball bat through like the eye socket.  And so he’s like, you know, I think you should go to, to Mayo. He’s like, I’ll, I’ll help you, you know, kind of introduce you to the right people. So I went  right, like  PNACUP blood test that day I had diagnosis.

So they see, this is 2010, right? That this was not that talked about nothing. Wait. So literally they sent me down and they’re like, You have celiac disease, disease in any sentence is not good.  And so I’m just sitting there, right? Like, you know, kind of head held low.  And I said, well, what does that mean? And they’re like, well, you can’t eat barley, wheat, or rye.

And I’m like, and what else? They’re like, that’s pretty much, I mean, there are other things, but that’s pretty much it. And I’m like, so if I don’t eat barley, wheat or rye, I’m going to feel much better and they’re like, pretty much. So they, they had me sit down with the rest of my time there  to help me manage.

And you know, she went through all this. I mean, then, Hey, there are things that like I learned later on  licorice. I mean, the things that you never think. Licorice has gluten in it, right? And some of these things now they have gluten free, but there were things you discover along the way. And I will tell you in 48 hours,  I was a new person.

Wow. I was amazing.  And I will tell you, it goes back to as well.  And it goes back to what I’ve always put my health on.  You know, at the top of my list, but it goes back to just kind of keep at it because, you know, if you, if you feel off, right, there, there is probably something there. It’s not in your head, no matter how many doctors tell you  that.

And so  I’ve had to be very, very careful with what I eat.  And  I will tell you for me, there was an endurance athlete. I was a triathlete at the time. It was. Harder to fuel for races if you’re not, you know, so that I will say that was for me. That was what kind of fell out of for me having celiac is that I really stopped competing  Like I had and so that that was like the other side of it Now like I mean now that i’ve got the classes i’m like This is like, you know, my, my new, like, you know, I haven’t tried them all yet.

Cause I got my, I did get my kind of like, you know, congrats on like, you know, you’re,  you’ve got all these classes, but I think that the,  you know, thinking about how to prioritize and where you spend your time, because it’s finite and it’s really difficult sometimes to make some of those decisions. But I think if you, I look at my calendar, the.

Beginning of every week, I look at the next, you know, the night before I do all my prep for the next day  and really trying to even like, if I have to work on something, right? Like prepare for Shelly’s podcast, right? Like I put time, I do put time on my calendar for that. And so I think it goes back to making appointments with yourself.

And that’s a way also to take that organization to just a whole new level. And I actually had somebody  suggest to me, right through people. Who are important in your life. It’s the same thing. Make a date with them. Right. And it can be three months out,  but it’s like, you know, you,  you know, it’s, and they said, it’s a date, a time and a place.

So I’m going to meet, you know, Shelly for coffee at a local coffee shop on November 5th at 3 p. But this idea, right, that you have it scheduled because then in your mind, right, you, not only do you have something to look forward to, but you have that kind of like touch base with that person. And you’re not letting things slide.

Like, Oh my, you know, I see you at a conference. I’m like, Oh, we should get together. But like, literally now, like what I do is I’ll,  yes, that’s great. Let’s say that. But like, let’s take out our calendars and do it right now. And people look at me like, what are you talking about?  But my  assistant will get in touch with your assistant.

I said. Let’s do it right now because even if we have to change it, that’s okay. But like we have it on our calendar. So those are some of the tips and tricks that, you know, just to kind of manage a lot in a,  and I think that  you have to ask for help, right? So I,  I’ve,  I think I joined my first board now almost, I was pretty young at the time,  almost eight years ago.

And, you know, trying to really understand governance and, you know, there, there are a lot of questions I had. I mean, there are questions, I mean, boards keep you on your toes, right? There’s a lot of questions you still have, but I had to ask people for help in terms of, you know, it’s like,  Shelly, do you play golf?

I feel like you do. Oh, I loved it. I love golf. Yes.  That’s what I was like. I think you play golf. I do. For those of you  who play golf, right. There’s very, there are sometimes there’s like written rules and then there’s unwritten rules. Yes. And, you know,  And, you know, I still remember my first time playing on a, at a work event and like walking through somebody’s line.

And I,  I love golf as well. I don’t know. There’s like something very  meditative for me, at least like everyone loves golf for different reasons, but I like the seventh hole. I’m just there. Like, I’m so happy. I love my life. Right. This is so great. Like, I’m like, I’m not right. This is a New Yorker. I’m in nature.

Right. Of course. So not everyone is going to understand that, but it’s like, it’s, there’s a lot of green and trees usually. And so I’m like, that’s, that’s part of their, and I like, you know, the social aspect  and I enjoy it. Right. I mean, it’s, it’s a fun sport, but it goes back to those kind of like written and unwritten.

And I think  not being afraid to ask people for help  because you’re not being vulnerable. You’re, you’re in some ways showing your strength because. Comfortable asking for help and I do think going back to kind of I think some of the theme of this podcast as a woman Sometimes I think we are  I am gonna use and I don’t like this word in this sentence But I I’m we’re afraid right that we’re gonna show that we’re vulnerable We’re gonna show that we don’t know something and you know what not we’re not  You know, we’re, we’re not omniscient.

We’re not omnipotent. We don’t know everything. We’re not all powerful  ask, right? Like, if you don’t know, I mean, Hey, there are things like I have my, um, my team, I’ll ask them. I said, you know, I don’t know how to do this. Can you record a video? Because I want to be able to, I don’t want someone to just to tell me I want to be able, cause I want to be the expert, right?

I want to be able to go back and watch it again and again and again. So that now it’s like in my head, and I don’t have to go back and ask or go back and read the notes.  I think also too, Shelley, we all have to know what kind of learners we are. Absolutely. I’m a definite visual learner. Well, I think that  the combination of like, I think the auditory plus the visual, right?

Like imprints on your mind in a certain way.  And some people learn by doing, but I do think that thing with the video that like, I can go back and then I’m going to just say, this is my last piece of advice, but I also have a,  and it’s a blessing and a curse. I’m going to be very honest.  I remember what people say and the exact words they use,  and it doesn’t really flush from my mind.

Wow. And so it’s good and it’s bad, right? If people have ever said anything negative to me, I do remember.  And so sometimes, right. And I found myself like I would avoid people, right. I’m good. And I like constructive feedback.  That’s the other thing, you know,  as women, sometimes we feel like we’re being attacked with that.

Like, I love it. I like run into it. I’m like, cause I want to be better. Right. I want to be better today than I was yesterday. I mean, that’s how I think about working out and eating right. And I don’t need a lot of sleep. So I understand most people need six, eight hours of sleep. My, my dad slept three to four.

I’m kind of in that, that camp as well. But I, I think this idea that we need to ask for help.  We need to be comfortable with constructive feedback. And you may want to say to the person, you know, that hurts. Is there another way that you can phrase that? Because I think we also just have to,  we need to be able to receive that and to be able to, and to ask questions.

But if we feel like someone, even if they’re not  yelling at us, if we feel that they are right, like when somebody uses all caps, which they may just have left the caps lock on an email,  right. But when we feel that then we may not be receptive. And so I, I think that there. Is a lot there in terms of  having a mentor that you, and, and seek ones out.

I mean, I, I’ve had, I don’t know if you’d want me to use his name or not, so I will choose not to. You can use his name. Well, I don’t know if he will, I like, he’s at a public company, but I will, but I’ll tell you, I sought him out and okay, this  is my last tip  because we’re running out of time. I know. Yes.

And you have to answer my last question. Okay. Okay. So. Okay. Bye. I speak to him every, that’s why we do podcasts at one o’clock. I speak to him every Friday at 12.  And having that going back to put it on your calendar, right. Having that constant touch base every week. And somebody who I am very receptive at, you know, kind of difficult messages.

I would say, seek somebody out like that in your life who either has done what you want to do, who you’re comfortable with, who you are inspired by, et cetera. But I do think that that, and that person may not, when you think about what that person might, they’re, they’re like, you know, kind of LinkedIn profile.

It might be. It’s probably different than what you think in terms of who actually will have an impact on you. That’s right So here’s my last question and this is a fun one and it can be anything It doesn’t have to be related to work. What is your secret power? Hmm?  That is a good one.  I mean I would say that I am  as a Professionally and personally I am a super connector  and right  if I  were to spend two  Quick minutes on that.

It’s that I get to really know people  and actually, you know, this does translate into work more than more than I think. So let me elaborate on that as well  is I really like to get to know people and what they do. I’m truly interested. I’m like, you know, if I, you know, maybe after I retire, I’ll become a recruiter

Cause I really,  really like understanding how people got to a certain place.  And then right when you meet somebody on the other side, you’re like, wow, they, they really have  backgrounds that fit really. Interestingly together, they’d like to get to know each other. I have to say sometimes my handoffs are not the best.

Cause I’m just like, Hey, Susie, meet Kyle. I think you guys would enjoy having a conversation. And then I don’t. So I’m like that I’m doing a better job at that  at work. Right. A lot of what Corsite does is we help  companies, you know, we do a lot of advisory work and through our advisory work, oftentimes we’re introducing them to startups.

And one of the things, and then we actually work with a lot of startups, right? We help them with their, you know, kind of think their thought leadership and having a voice. So we really get to know both constituencies.  And a lot of times when we make introductions to retailers, brands, technology companies of other, you know, of startups, it’s because not only is that the right fit in terms of a want and a need, but there’s also a.

A personality fit and like a cultural fit. And I think that that super connector aspect of that, I  think that’s what fills in kind of the, the cracks in the cement in terms of how I look at that. But I am an extreme extrovert  for anyone who knows me. And so I think that that’s why, right? Like I will tell you, and I don’t know about you, Shelly, during the pandemic, I’m like, Oh my gosh.

I’m like, I’m, I’m literally right. Like, first of all, for those of you know, I was commuting to Hong Kong. Right. So, I mean, I was like, that was like what I was doing pre pandemic and, and into Shanghai, we had a lab there. So I mean, I was commuting to greater China, right? Like,  and then all of a sudden it just stopped.

Right. And I’m like, okay, I’m like spending a lot of time with my family, my guinea pigs, my dogs, right? Like, I’m like, yeah, I’m like talking to the guinea pigs at night, put them on the, you know,  whole conversation.  You know, the, I started to find, so this is like, we’ll just, we’ll leave on this note.  I knew that I had like kind of crossed to the other side.

And I don’t know what that was when I was like, I started to look forward to zooms because I was like, I would get energy from being on a zoom. And I’m like, it’s  not, I’m like, I have been  locked away for too long. Right. Going back to like that, that energy that you get. And I gotta tell you, going back to, I still remember certain zoom calls I’ve had pandemic and not where, you know, it was just as you knew in five minutes and you’re like, I want to spend a lot of time with this person because they just have.

An energy about them and a wisdom that I know I’ll be a better person. If I’m like spending time with them just for longer, it can be on zoom or it can be over a cup of coffee or whatever it might be, but those are the things. And I think that if someone looks at how I spend my time, Shelly,  you might say, wow, you could be so much more productive.

You could be doing this,  but I spend my time with people who I enjoy spending time with, and that I think is great. That’s ame thing.  And that also may be as women sometimes.  We may not always think about the, the dollars and cents of it. We may think about like, what’s sparking joy for us. And for me, it’s who I spend time with and the conversations I have,  but I’m not always like my, yes, of course, as a former, you know, well, as a CPA, right

I know the dollars and cents of how I spend my time,  but I don’t write on my own personal balance sheet. I don’t always, you know, kind of. Spend my time with whom will have the greatest impact on the dollars and cents at core site, because it’s not consistent with my personal values.  And I think we all have to know, right.

You have to know yourself well.  And okay. One last very quick story on this. Okay.  So I was, when I was at city. We used to do these non deal roadshows, which I enjoyed, and we’d do mall tours. I, I love doing the mall tours, because then you’d work with all the other analysts, and you’d have a bus, and it was complex, but fun.

And let’s just say chaos with a little bit of structure.  And one of my colleagues, we were doing this joint bus tour, and she’s like, I’m going to tell so and so that they can’t come because they’re in an account that doesn’t matter.  So because we each had like 15 clients we could have and so she told him no and I like I call him like I’m Like I said, I got 15 spots.

I’d love to have you right like I love you.  So I kid you not  Two weeks later. He calls me and he’s like that was the best decision you ever made I was like, well, I said you’re you’re something I consider a friend I said, of course I got to spend time with you as a friend. He’s like  no, he’s like I just took a Portfolio manager role,  and I won’t use the name of the company at one of the largest  hedge funds at the time.

And he said, and I am going to make sure that we spend time with you. We get to know you, right? And the whole firm does. And so it goes back to Shelly.  If you spend time with people who you enjoy spending time with and you connect with,  not always thinking about the dollars and cents,  I always think it kind of works out.

It’s not karma as something else, right? It’s just kind of doing the right thing  and it comes back to you.  That’s great. Debra. Debra first. I want to thank you so much for being on my podcast. We’re so excited Thank you for sharing your professional and personal journey. So I really appreciate that and Before we leave, it’s, is it okay if I tell everyone about your book?

So you recently coauthored a book, Next Generation Retail, How to Use New Technology to Innovate for the Future. And my favorite part of the book was talking about how retailers need to fund their own innovation. So congrats on that. And thank you for being here. Really appreciate it. Thanks Shelly. I can’t wait to turn the tables on you and get your life stories.

So I’m excited. Thanks for having me on. This is. Really, you know, it’s, it’s great to give people the opportunity, I think, to share some of what they’ve learned along the way. And we all have gotten to where we are through, you know, very different paths.  And that, you know, but that collective wisdom, I think, can really help, you know, the next generation.

I mean, a lot of stuff that we, I mean, I don’t know how you kind of codify this, but right, like a lot of the mistakes that we all made or things that we wish we had done different, right. If we can help the next generation, right. Get there faster. What a gift that we can give them. And thank you for doing this.

It really is having an impact.