Shelley E. Kohan (00:02.018)
Melissa, I am so excited to have you on Lead Like Her. Welcome.

Melissa Gonzalez (00:06.8)
Thank you so much for having me.

Shelley E. Kohan (00:09.408)
I love watching you in the industry. You are such a dynamic leader. You’re founder, principal, you’re among other roles. You’ve done so much for our industry. And I really truly believe that your genuine mission is to help our industry. I think it’s great.

Melissa Gonzalez (00:26.832)
Thank you. Well, you know, it’s funny. I had a meeting yesterday at Columbus Circle, and I do find that I always, when I go to these destinations, I’m just always watching. I’m like, you know, who’s delivering joy? What’s making people excited? What’s making people want to engage? And I just think it’s like a constant study, especially as the world continues to evolve so much, and that’s part of what keeps it so exciting.

Shelley E. Kohan (00:50.668)
I know you have this kind of mission, this unwavering mission, to make the industry better and to really connect the dots and to make the customer experience better at the end of the day. So my first question is really about you are dealing with employees, you have to deal with investors, you have business partners, you have manufacturers and on and on. How do you stay true to your mission and how do you get others to join that mission with the same passion that you have?

Melissa Gonzalez (00:54.884)
Yeah.

Melissa Gonzalez (01:18.958)
I mean, I think it’s a constant study and curiosity and that’s how, know, I think, again, it’s like, it’s just ever evolving. If I think of from, you know, when I started my career on Wall Street and things we kind of studied, right, because you’re trying to figure out what we’re gonna make stocks move and what was gonna make management teams successful and stuff. And then to today, so that’s a span of 25 years, it’s like, you know, so much has changed, right? So much has evolved how we interact in our everyday life.

And so we have to continuously understand how that’s going to shape expectations of how people want to interact in general, you know? And so I think it’s just constantly educating best I can. And others will translate that through their own mediums, whether that’s through design or architecture, through technology integration. But for me, it’s sitting as much as they can at that forefront of the thought process of,

you know, what does this say? Like what is driving behavior? What are the big drivers in the world? And then what does that mean about how people are beginning to interact in their everyday life for that constant evolution of it? And then what does that mean, you know, about how they want to interact with brands and retailers from a consumer standpoint, physical environments, but even the holistic ecosystem of a brand. And because people don’t think of brands as just…

one touch point, they don’t think of a brand as a store, they don’t think of a brand as a website, they think of a brand as the holistic experience. So what does that look like? And then to that question too, like right now we’re actively working on our Gen Alpha report, which will be released in January. you know, there’s so many assumptions about what that generation wants, technology being one of them. We just think they want tech in stores, but when you talk to them, they don’t think about tech, right? It’s born in their hands, it’s not novel to them like it was to our generation.

for them, it’s what is it unable for them, what access it gives them, you know, how does it allow them to engage, discover, and all of that. And so we then are challenged to make sure that we’re bringing the right lens to how we think about how that then translates into physical environments.

Shelley E. Kohan (03:34.882)
That’s amazing. So now I’m curious. So in your early days on Wall Street, first of all, I can’t even imagine being on Wall Street. To me, it’s so far. It’s such a different world from how I grew up. But how did that inform your future kind of vision? And how did that inform you those early years for you?

Melissa Gonzalez (03:37.251)
Yeah.

Melissa Gonzalez (03:44.087)
It’s a different world, yeah.

Melissa Gonzalez (03:55.782)
I think it’s because I spent so much time listening to management teams, whether they were coming to present to us or if I was going on the road show with them and literally sitting in all those meetings with investors and listening to the questions and how people are thinking of valuation and what would move the needle, what would set them back, what would give them competitive differentiation. And so always being that hard at those conversations. And at the time it was cross industries because I was a generalist, so it wasn’t just consumer, it was

you know retail companies it was CPG companies it was Internet so I mean back in the day was like you know if you think of like IMAX and Netflix and all those things it was super early days for all of them trying to figure out who they were gonna be and how they were gonna make that work so taking that thought process and then bringing it over to working with founders and digital natives and

you know, them trying to figure out how they were going to continue to scale their brand and, you know, how they think about what their brand positioning, you know, means and how that translate across different platforms. So I learned a lot and I think I learned a lot also because when you’re on Wall Street, you have constant information coming at you. the ability to, okay, there’s all these different points of information coming at me, being able to distill that information, synthesize that information.

Shelley E. Kohan (05:12.44)
Right.

Melissa Gonzalez (05:20.293)
and understand how to translate that into opportunities or risks, and then kind of jump off from there. So I think when I sit in meetings on average, I’m not an analyst, but I am always thinking of kind of the bigger picture while I’m in the conversation, like, well, what does this mean? What does this mean? And so that’s kind of, think, what I brought from my days on Wall Street.

Shelley E. Kohan (05:48.578)
That’s amazing. So what were some of your significant challenges that you faced on your path to leadership and what did you do to overcome them?

Melissa Gonzalez (05:58.308)
Yeah, think, know, like being somebody who pivoted from Wall Street to the retail industry, I didn’t leave Wall Street saying I wanted to be in retail, to be honest. I always had an affinity to consumer-based companies, so, but, and retail just happened to be where it ended up manifesting due to an opportunity that crossed my path when I left Wall Street, but I knew I wanted to leave because I wanted to pursue more creative path that could leverage my skillset.

And so…

I think the first thing was being able to translate that and really build a whole new network. So I had support from those on Wall Street, but entering a whole new field, really having to build that network and kind of understand the challenges and the nuances and understand not just the consumer side, but the brand side and the considerations and understand what would work and what wouldn’t work and how do we test and learn together. So that was the first part. And then, you we were

acquired and so and then were acquired again. I think then there’s the and Christina Nunez just came out with this great blog on her sub stack about this and the beauty industry and it’s not the founder dilemma but kind of you know I think that was my next learning is as a founder you have vision and you have to build teams and there’s this like dance you have to do and figuring out like what is letting go look like successfully but also letting go doesn’t mean you disappear.

either, so what is the evolution that’s most successful for that mindset, that’s that visionary mindset, but that can still have impact both internally and externally. And I think sometimes there’s more of an ability for a company to understand the external impact than the internal as you grow and scale.

Shelley E. Kohan (08:00.63)
Yeah, definitely. So can you share a time when you had to make a difficult decision and maybe the thought process behind that?

Melissa Gonzalez (08:09.291)
I mean, all the time, I feel like I have to make difficult decisions. So do you want it more from a team standpoint, a client standpoint, a career standpoint? Career. Yeah, I think from a career standpoint, my first difficult was leave Wall Street and start a whole.

Shelley E. Kohan (08:19.534)
Career, let’s do career.

Melissa Gonzalez (08:29.829)
whole new path and I learned so much in retrospect from that and I think with there I didn’t really have a defined path but I gave myself a runway. I said I’ll give myself six months, I have this kind of budget to live off of and this is how it’s gonna measure success in that time period to decide if it was like a go no go, am I continuing in this path? And I actually had three ideas at that time and one very clearly showed itself as the path to

Shelley E. Kohan (08:51.352)
time.

Melissa Gonzalez (08:59.783)
Revenue, know the others I was passionate about and it was really fun But one was driving organic inbound and then even through that process, you know, even as a founder then I was always like, okay I saw growth and then I saw it be stagnant. So how are we gonna evolve? You know, are we gonna go into this or that and I think I learned a lot too of you know Just because you see opportunity For growth doesn’t mean you’re the the person or the team to go chase that

that either and I think that that could be really seducing sometimes because you still have to understand, everything’s competitive. And so if you see a growth opportunity, many do too. So do you have the right vision for it? Do you have the right team for it? Do you have the right approach for it? So right time, right place. And many times I’d have an idea it was too early. The market wasn’t ready for that and it would cost too much to get it off the ground.

Shelley E. Kohan (09:50.114)
Yeah, I’m sure.

Melissa Gonzalez (09:58.316)
So a lot of learnings along the way with that stuff.

Shelley E. Kohan (10:02.594)
That’s great. So, I mean, if you look at our industry, I mean, can it be more complex than it is today? I mean, it is, is. my gosh. It’s so challenging. And when we came out of COVID, I’m like, okay, can’t get any more challenging than what we went through COVID. But now I’m finding it actually is very challenging. So how are you in empowering and supporting your team members to Excel?

Melissa Gonzalez (10:07.365)
I know, especially with AI. Yeah.

Melissa Gonzalez (10:26.105)
I mean, I think we had to embrace very quickly different ways of working. And I think that that’s not going away in that we have to have that mindset. So it’s challenging in that there’s so much optionality out there.

when we work with our clients, it’s like, how are we going to help them authentically cut through that noise and stand out and also understand, you know, the point of a store today is very different than 10 years ago and really five years ago, right? And it’s going to continue to evolve even more, especially as you have Gen Z, they’ve come to age, Gen Alpha is coming to age next, and you know, their expectations of what they want are

Shelley E. Kohan (10:58.744)
that five years ago.

Yeah.

Melissa Gonzalez (11:13.367)
are going to be some part of it kind of going back to what was, but with a new spin on it. And so how do these environments cultivate community and connectivity and personalization and all the things that they want and working with our clients to understand that how we measure success in a store in the next couple years is different than the last few years.

And holistically, just all of us understanding that. And I think if we’re successful, our job is to be a coach to our clients too. So we kind of have to be ahead of the curve in understanding that so we can bring that thought process to them as well. And a lot of the times, unless you’re working directly with the leaders, then you’re working with the next tier that then has to go to their leaders for that buy-in. It’s not easy.

Shelley E. Kohan (12:08.076)
Yeah, no, it’s definitely not easy. So I want to talk a little bit about your leadership skills. So our mission in doing this podcast is to provide inspiration to future female leaders, but also help our existing leaders in the industry to succeed. So how do you actively mentor and support the development of future female leaders? How do you incorporate mentorship in your everyday life?

Melissa Gonzalez (12:29.443)
Yeah, I mean, I think I’m always learning on that side and it’s hard because,

Well, right now it’s been a busy time, but when you’re not in everything, don’t have the purview of all the challenges that they all have, right? So I think as you’re a leader, you’re understanding like, I gotta step out of the day to day, so I’m not gonna see the day to day, but how do I still stay on the pulse of things so that as a mentor, because sometimes I think it’s tricky. Sometimes leadership can feel so disconnected to what that everyday looks like that

there can be a mindset like, don’t really understand my challenge, right? So how do you create those lines of communication so you can be stepping out and enabling and empowering them, but also be able to have those grounded conversations. And so, you know, I put either a monthly or a quarterly on the calendar, depending on what that person’s role is. And I really present it to them as it’s their meeting.

So, you what do you want to get out of this meeting? You know, ideally they’re coming with some sort of thoughts or agenda. And I try to ask them how I could be helpful versus making the assumption of like, this is how I’m going to solve your problem. Sometimes I just want to talk it through, you know, sometimes they’re not seeing their blind spots, you know, sometimes. So it’s a lot of different things. So it’s that. I try, I’ve tried to over the years learn that my job isn’t necessarily

Shelley E. Kohan (13:56.894)
yeah.

Melissa Gonzalez (14:06.951)
to solve their problems unless that’s where we’re at. Sometimes you do, sometimes you have to step in and be like, okay, I to solve this problem. But other times, you know, they want the ability to solve it. They’re just like kind of zigzagging away from the right way to get to that solution. And so sometimes you just have to bring them back. And then the other thing I think is…

Shelley E. Kohan (14:11.182)
Yeah, true.

Melissa Gonzalez (14:29.717)
I’ve tried to cultivate relationships outside of me, which I think is sometimes hard as a leader also because you want to be in that connectivity with the team and that saying. There’s a few things I’ve seen on Instagram lately. was one that he, was a founder of,

It was an athletic brand, but it was so ready. like I wake up every morning and I basically know I’m gonna disappoint somebody and like that’s true. It’s very true. And then the other thing is just, you know, you…

Shelley E. Kohan (14:54.926)
Melissa Gonzalez (15:04.065)
you’re not their friend. As much as you’re friendly with them, it’s this realization of knowing you just aren’t because you’re the boss. So I think you have to get to be at peace with that a little bit. And I think when you transition from being a small company founder led this and that, you know everybody. know every intern and every employee. know everybody’s birthday. You know all the things. And then as you grow in scale, you know less of those things. And others do. And others have that connectivity. you’re kind of more on the outside trying

Shelley E. Kohan (15:08.045)
Right.

Melissa Gonzalez (15:33.912)
trying to be cognizant of those things. So I try to make sure that I know the important things and realizing I’m not gonna know everything and try to balance out like, okay, what are the big things that I’m gonna make sure that I’m touching base on or remembering? Somebody’s got a big exam coming up or obviously if they’re having a baby or whatever, the big things that I can kind of remember so they know I think they’re important.

But I’m not going to have that same connectivity with them that I would have had ten years ago.

Shelley E. Kohan (16:09.922)
Wow, that’s great. What do you think are some of the barriers that hold women back from rising to the top of their fields? There’s clearly a dearth in our industry with women at the top levels. And so what do you think holds women back?

Melissa Gonzalez (16:25.313)
I mean, I think, you know…

It depends. think it’s situational a little bit because not every environment infrastructure is the same. I think now in today’s age, there’s more women groups that are supportive of each other, which is great, which I think is helpful. at the end of the day, you need people who are going to say your name and opportunities in the room. And I think that, you know, there’s been a little bit of a gap in that because there’s been so few women at the top, it created a competitive environment versus a collaborative, supportive

Shelley E. Kohan (16:58.51)
Right. Right.

Melissa Gonzalez (16:59.345)
environment, right? Because it’s like there’s only room for one or two that I want that person to be me. I’ve been fortunate. Yeah.

Shelley E. Kohan (17:05.304)
I never looked at it that way. my God, you’re so right. That’s what’s created this kind of competitive nature of women getting to the top.

Melissa Gonzalez (17:14.091)
Yeah, like external forces. So we have to open the doors for each other. I’ve been in male dominated industries for sure. I would say architecture, more so than design, but architecture and then for sure Wall Street. But I’ve also been fortunate that I would say like, it’s not necessarily been the mindset of leadership.

You know, MG2 board has been balanced. It’s like 50-50 male-female. But yeah, I think it’s that unconscious competitiveness that rises because of that dynamic. And then I think, you know, men just have to get more comfortable with different communication styles and all this stuff that I think. But also we can too, because I don’t think we’re going to necessarily change each other. And so I’ve learned that

delivery differs a lot of the time and how things are communicated, the tone, the pitch of the tone, all the things that translate very differently. You could say the same exact message, right? And the way it’s delivered is different and we can’t be intimidated by that, right? And we have to learn how to navigate through that. I think, you know, being able to come head to head in conversations, you know, sometimes I think has translated

where sometimes women think like, okay, well, I gotta put my battle gear on, you know, or I gotta, right, because I gotta be as tough and I gotta be there. But I do think that we have this differentiated talent, if we embrace it, to actually disarm them more than we think, because I think we have an ability to cut through that with rationale. And I’ve personally had a couple of examples where I’ve done that in a conversation, where I’ve been the only woman in the room

Shelley E. Kohan (18:38.168)
Yeah.

Melissa Gonzalez (19:03.173)
where.

I’ve seen it become this dialogue that even the male counterparts themselves are kind of coming a little head to head and being able to be the one to say in the room, like, hey, are we willing to have a different point of view on this conversation? And I think that we can come with a different level of emotional intelligence, but a lot of the times they’re just not wired the same way. And if we can trust that, I think we actually can navigate more conversations.

than we think.

Shelley E. Kohan (19:36.035)
Yeah, we the emotional intelligence is a big thing for sure. So I want to go back to something you said early about networking and how when you left Wall Street, you had this network of Wall Street people and then you go into this new industry and you got to start from scratch. So one of the biggest concerns with young leader is, you know, networking is so important, but they don’t have the breadth and depth of contacts. So how did you build this? Like you are one of the most connected networked people that I know.

Melissa Gonzalez (20:02.851)
Yeah.

Shelley E. Kohan (20:03.224)
How do you build it? How do you start from scratch and how do you build it?

Melissa Gonzalez (20:07.469)
Yeah, I mean, think definitely with authenticity and that, you know, nobody wants to feel like you’re trying to network them. You know what I mean? And so and also there’s different levels and tiers. so there’s your peer network. Right. Like, who’s that? And then there’s like people who have further along in their career, but you aspire to be like, know, I think that clarity as to what they’ve achieved that you are aspiring to achieve is helpful so that you’re intentional about that.

Because you’re going to intersect with those communities differently, right? The way you interact with your peers. You could be door openers for each other. You can learn from each other in different ways. you a lot of my network, they’re further in their career than I am. Some of them are even retired. But I’ve admired things that they’ve accomplished. And I can clearly articulate in a conversation to them what I’ve

what those things are. And you also have to understand what the value exchange is in those different tiers of network, I think, so that you’re appropriate about them, you know? So I think…

For example, if it’s somebody who’s achieved a ton, I usually like, I got my one ask. I’m not going to them all the time for that, right? And I’m also trying to make sure I’m providing value back where possible. Whereas your peer network, you might partner in different ways because you’re more at that equal playing field of what you can bring each other in the table, but you could still learn from each other, open doors, support each other, et cetera. So I think intentionality is just

Shelley E. Kohan (21:22.23)
Right, right, yeah.

Melissa Gonzalez (21:43.51)
a really important part of it. sometimes it’s a network just based on the fact that it’s women. Sometimes it’s a network because it’s grounded in design and architecture. Sometimes it’s a network because it’s founders. And so it’s different elements too that I think it’s important to have clarity on.

Shelley E. Kohan (22:04.952)
So let’s turn to your fantastic new book that you just launched, The Purpose Pivot. It is an outstanding read. I suggest everyone read it. I love the book. I love the stories. But one of the things that you say in the book is this normalizing slow. And I think that’s really important for young executives to understand. How have you implemented this philosophy at the executive level? And did you face any resistance, really, I guess, from yourself more than anything else?

Melissa Gonzalez (22:33.669)
Well, I think it’s hard when you say it that way. It sounds very unattractive. Like normalizing slow, what? You know, I think we wear the hustle as the badge of honor, for sure. And you know, the impetus of my book was a medical experience I had in 24.

And I can’t say it wasn’t because I was necessarily burnt out, but it was the realization that I didn’t make my well-being as high a priority as I could have alongside my career journey and my leadership path. And so, you know, for younger generations that read this book, I think there’s just so much that you can learn to be preventative about it so that you don’t wait till you have those crucible moments that make you say, like, wait, why wasn’t that more important? My body was talking to me and I didn’t prioritize making space for that.

Normalizing slow doesn’t necessarily mean that you’re gonna, those terms of what, like the quiet resignation and all of that. just means that you’re going to…

Shelley E. Kohan (23:27.565)
no.

Melissa Gonzalez (23:32.016)
Think differently about your energy preservation and allocation, and really focus more on the things that fuel you versus deplete you. And be less seduced by the whole thought process of FOMO, which I think we live in this constantly connected world, right? We’re just always, we’re always connected to seeing, like I’m in a chat today and it’s some things that I can’t make, where other women are going to and I could feel a lot of guilt and pressure about it, but I have a really important executive

team meeting tomorrow that I cannot miss and so I can’t be there and the woman who’s being honored like I message her on the such side right away to say nobody deserves to be celebrated more than you and the right friend the right counterparts gonna know that you genuinely mean that and not gonna give you the guilt about it like so instead of turning myself into 20 pretzels tomorrow and disappointing and upsetting you know my exec team or whatever like this is the choice I have to make

Shelley E. Kohan (24:08.174)
Aww.

Melissa Gonzalez (24:29.825)
And because I think also when you try to be in all the places and all the things, you actually stop being present in most of the things you do. And so to me, normalizing slow is also honoring your presence in the things that you choose to spend time doing. And so I think when you turn that switch from fear of missing out to joy of missing out, you’re going to do things with more intentionality. It’s not about that constant comparison cycle. It’s not about over

Shelley E. Kohan (24:44.044)
Hmm.

Melissa Gonzalez (24:59.719)
extending yourself, it’s not about valuing the busier I am, the more valued I am, the more events I go to, the more important I am. It’s saying, okay, where can I have impact? Where do I need to be now? Where can I give myself the grace to say this is where I’m gonna be present? And you can actually do so many less things from a quantity standpoint in your day or in your week or in your month, but achieve so much more.

And so it’s learning to trust that which is not easy, but that is what that theme is about

Shelley E. Kohan (25:33.366)
I love that and JoMo, you just came up with a new Ackerman, JoMo. The joy of missing out.

Melissa Gonzalez (25:36.234)
well, I can’t take full credit of it, but it is funny as they talk about it. A lot of people are like, I haven’t heard of it. But I think it started a little bit in COVID where people were kind of like, you know, I’m in my pajamas tonight and not going out and things like that. But.

But yeah, because don’t put that guilt on yourself so much that you can’t be at all the things. You can’t be at all the things, just you can’t. It’s impossible to be at everything all the time. But where should you be? Maybe it needs a different filter.

Shelley E. Kohan (26:08.128)
I love one thing I learned from you. went to your book launch, which was fabulous down at the Creighton Barrel store on Broadway. And one thing I learned that just kind of hit me really hard was that when you were talking about, you just mentioned like these Instagramable moments. So our whole life is seeing this perfect snapshot of something, but there’s a whole backstory behind those perfect visuals. And I never really thought about that. There’s a lot of, you know, to get to that point.

Melissa Gonzalez (26:12.783)
Yes.

Shelley E. Kohan (26:36.718)
Our life is not a perfect snapshot and you have to like let go of that, you know, visualization that your life is a perfect snapshot or trying to get to that perfect snapshot. That’s just not what it is.

Melissa Gonzalez (26:49.475)
No, it’s not. It’s not what it is. And I think if you ask a lot of people, how did you get to that moment, there’s probably a lot of bumps along the way to get there and stuff. So yeah, and I think the book is not just my point of view. I interviewed dozens of women, and I think it’s realizing that that is the human side of all of this. And I think when you trust that, it can give you the ability to give yourself more grace through all of it.

Shelley E. Kohan (26:56.43)
You

Shelley E. Kohan (27:20.032)
It’s great, great book, recommended read for sure. Okay, so now we’re gonna get to my favorite part of our conversation called rapid fire questions where I’m just gonna ask you questions, quick, quick, quick, and you’re just gonna give me answers. Are you ready? Okay, here we go. What one piece of advice would you give female leaders that are currently working?

Melissa Gonzalez (27:25.605)
Mm-hmm.

Melissa Gonzalez (27:33.881)
Okay, yes.

Melissa Gonzalez (27:44.165)
Just keep your purpose as your North Star. I think when you feel overwhelmed and you need that filter to say like, what am I saying yes to, what am I making space for, think of your purpose.

Shelley E. Kohan (27:57.623)
What three tips would you give students, our emerging leaders?

Melissa Gonzalez (28:03.845)
Be constantly curious, be humble, and remember the long game because everything can feel catastrophic in the moment when it doesn’t land exactly as the way you see it, but take that as an opportunity to learn from it and you’re gonna do it differently and better the next time.

Shelley E. Kohan (28:23.262)
And lastly, what is your legacy? What do you want to leave behind for that next generation?

Melissa Gonzalez (28:30.213)
Gosh, mean, I think that’s evolved a little bit through writing the book. So I think it’s that well-being is not a side project in life. And if the more people that can embrace that, then I will feel like I left an impactful mark.

Shelley E. Kohan (28:49.834)
Okay, so this is my last question. It can be fun, it can be anything. What is your secret power?

Melissa Gonzalez (28:53.08)
Okay.

Melissa Gonzalez (28:57.269)
my secret power.

I mean, I think my secret power is my ability on average to cut through the noise. I have a lot of things coming at me all the time, and I don’t always get it perfect for sure, but I think my ability, I don’t get trapped in the inertia of it. I’m able to step back and be like, how are we solving this? So sometimes it’s a downfall because I don’t have the patience for it, but most times it’s successful in that it allows me to move on to the next thing versus getting stuck

on it.

Shelley E. Kohan (29:32.364)
Well, Melissa, thank you so much for being here and thank you for sharing lots of leadership tips. Is there anything you’d like to close with or share?

Melissa Gonzalez (29:40.709)
You know, I’m just really excited about the year ahead. I don’t know if this is going live in 25 or 26, but, you know, for 25, I feel like there’s been just so much discovery and conversation. We’ve been on this five-year trajectory through COVID and inflation and…

politics and tariffs and this hyper connectivity across all generations. And I do think across a lot of those generations, you’re starting to see this recognition of it’s not all healthy. And so I’m really curious to see how that’s going to translate into 26. You know, how all environments, physical environments will evolve, how retail environments will evolve, how it’ll brace the aspect of slowing

Shelley E. Kohan (29:58.819)
tariffs.

Melissa Gonzalez (30:27.813)
down to connect more, you know, and what the evolution of that community building and brands being at the nucleus of that, what that will continue to look like, and how well-being will continue to intersect with the industry.

Shelley E. Kohan (30:44.812)
Well, thank you and thank you so much for all the wonderful work you do in the industry and I look forward to seeing what’s up next for you. So thank you for being here.

Melissa Gonzalez (30:53.232)
Thank you. Thank you so much for having me. I always love our conversations.